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January 03, 2018 / Wednesday Chat with Bill

buttons: bill yes, swan was just saying that the other night and I think that so often we get ourselves into a state because we can't forgive ourselves rather than because of what others have done. God is the great forgiver and clearer of sins if He can send His son to take our sins then we have no reason to hold onto them and not forgive ourselves (another thing I heard paraphrased).

Bill: Swan: Thank you for what you shared. You pointed out two of the most important decisions that must be made in order to reach wellness and gain control over our personal growth. "I finally had to find a way to forgive" and "the depression was having adverse affects on my life." In order to overcome this kind of thing from the past, we have to set our hearts free with forgiveness. Then we have to empower our choices by taking responsibility for how life is impacting us. Way to go, keep telling this story.

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January 03, 2018 / Wednesday Chat with Bill

Bill: Hi Dumbfounded2: How are you tonight?

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Swan: Hi All, hope your new year is starting full of blessings

Bill: Hi Swan. So far, things are going well and I too hope the year is filled with blessings.

Swan: Bill - isn't 8 considered the year of completion, I am hoping for many things to become complete. My poor husband has a heart condition and is waiting for a heart transplant, I don't wish ill for anyone else, but I do desire his heart problems to be over for him. He is a high stress person to being with and having the heart issues are concerning since he never learned how to deal with stress other than expressing it through outburst and from what I have heard from friends and family his outburst have turned to raging fits.

Swan: Hi dumbfounded - how was your Christmas?

Bill: Swan: Yes, 8 is considered a number of completion and, as long as we don't take it too far, I think praying for things to "complete" is a good approach. I certainly agree with your prayer for your H. We certainly don't want to pray that anyone will suffer tragedy but we know that hearts will be available and there is no reason not to enthusiastically pray your H gets one.

Swan: Bill - As I typed that my husband never learned to deal with stress, it reminds me of stories the older siblings will tell about their childhoods and each of them have a story or more about my husband as a child throwing little temper tantrums when he didn't get his way and throwing fits when he got older. Oddly he didn't behave that way for most of our marriage, I mean he got upset or angry about things, but didn't go into the full blown raging fits I hear tell of then and now. Although I did see some of what they speak of during the last year of our marriage, it was mostly why I opted to leave our home and live with my son long before there was even talk of a divorce. I have sometimes wondered if I hadn't moved out would he have filed for divorce, but then I have to remind myself that I didn't feel safe and the night he took a swing at me because his girlfriend and he had a fight, I wasn't willing to stay and find out what risk there was. I also think sometimes that God is protecting me by there being no contact between my husband and me, because as much as I love him I cannot deal with that type of violence.

Bill: Swan: I know that we both believe in marriage as a covenant relationship which means we hold out hope for all relationships. Physical violence, however, is in a category all its own. I counsel people on a regular basis to move as slow as possible in deciding what to do with a troubled relationship except when there is violence. At that point, it is not safe and steps have to be taken. Your choice to move out when H took a swing at you was the obvious right move and I agree that God has been taking steps to protect you ever since.

Bill: It is even more important that you moved out when you realized the swing was in response to an argument he had with his girlfriend. This takes crazy to a new level.

Bill: Swan: I have consistently seen miracles in marriages getting restored but it has always been accompanied by honest evaluation, genuine repentance and an "urgency" to get well whatever it takes.

Bill: Hi Buttons.

buttons: Hi Bill and Swan how are both of you?

Bill: Hi Buttons: I am doing well. Thank you for asking. Pam and I are finally on the tail end of a nagging cold and ready to focus for the new year. I also got to see all my kids and grandkids in December which I loved.

Swan: Bill - I recently got a card from an old friend who had been stationed with my husband for many years, I would say the closest to a best friend for him and he mentioned in the letter that he just doesn't know how to deal with my husband anymore because he is so negative and sometimes just downright nasty. He said he has been considering cutting the relationship and wanted my view on it. I basically let him know that he can still be a friend, offer up prayers and leave the door open, but also inform my husband that he has become a toxic relationship and not one the friend wants to continue. This friend knows there is no contact between my husband and I, as he said no one knows my husband better than I do, even considering!

Swan: Bill - Fortunately for me that night the old hand to hand combat training I had back in the 80's kicked in and his swing was a miss. I spent too many years as a child being beating; I simply cannot deal with it as an adult that part of my life has to be over, I just cannot do it.

buttons: All my H heads overseas again and I am praying for that I find a new way of feeling and dealing with this. At this point I know he is feeling frustrated by his business overseas as there are quiet times and then requests for funds again and sometimes more than once in a short time. At the same time he got himself into this and continues to carry this as it involves people who need a way to survive and do their best to provide for themselves. I'm feeling overwhelmed already because we now have a fur baby that requires walks and will get into trouble if she doesn't get enough exercise and attention, it's going to fall mostly on me as our D works same time frames as me and her BF may or may not remember to take fur baby out or give her attention

buttons: Bill it is always nice to see family, our D, her BF, S and his GF and myself spent time with my dad and the rest of my family (that side) for Christmas my Dad is in a care home now however was home for Christmas, it was nice. I still have my mom to see

Swan: Bill - Grandkids are the best aren't they! I only have the one and I am fortunate that I live with him, but I have to say he is growing right under my nose. The other night I looked over at him as he was standing next to his dad and they are only about an inch different in height. My gosh he is a man, driving, has a deep voice, is taller than me, all those little boy features are gone and he even has a girlfriend. They grow way too fast. Glad you got to spend time with yours.

Bill: Swan: I am glad to hear "that part of your life is over" because it should be. It is also sad to hear that your H is sabotaging what could be a great friendship. I am always amazed when stuff like this happens. Early on I believed people had to hit bottom in order to have a "wake up" moment. I have just seen too many times when this wasn't the case (my FIL being a clear example). I have now concluded that we never know what will wake people up. We just need to pray for them and ask God to use something to get their attention.

buttons: Bill there are praises in that I turned 50 this year and my H took it upon himself to call my mom and step-dad and invite them to a surprise party for me up until now he's not really wanted to have anything to do with them as a result of the support they gave me when things first blew up and my step-dad said a few things that might have struck nerves too

buttons: bill it seems like a good number of people are spending the holidays sick- either Christmas or the start of the New Year

Bill: Buttons: Congrats on the surprise Bday party and welcome to the 50s! "Jesus, please give Buttons the grace she needs to manage life while her H is overseas. Also give her H surprising strength and wisdom to handle his responsibilities and stay connected with his family here in the states."

Bill: Swan: They grow up way too fast so I am trying to stay diligent in seeing them often and celebrating them as they grow.

buttons: swan they don't realize the hurt and toxins the place on others, I'm glad you were able to provide this friend with a caring way to put the wish to draw back a bit. Hugs with the beatings as a child, no one deserves to be hit or hurt

buttons: bill thank you for the prayers (I am in Canada)

Bill: buttons: I knew that but I was typing and thinking too fast!

Swan: Bill - I have heard the hit bottom thing as well and I would have thought my husband hit bottom awhile back, but I just assumed his bottom was way deeper than mine view of what it should be. He is a very stubborn man; it might bite him in the backside if he continues to hold onto whatever keeps him in the state he is in. He has told me and others that he is miserable every moment of every day; one would think he would leave that state, but instead he stays and wallows in his muck. I find myself praying for and having empathy for the other woman, I hear she gets a lot of his rage, I would also think she wouldn't stay and put up with it, but she does. I just don't understand and prayer is all I can offer them.

buttons: all I think that each person does have a different view of what rock bottom is, really it is only God who knows what point each person needs to reach before they see His plans for them and turn back to His love

Bill: Swan: Well said. My FIL lost his health, lost his career, lost his wife, lived separated from family (siblings as well as kids) and still would not give up on his stubbornness, bitterness or love of alcohol. Hitting bottom does not always have the effect we think it will. All we can do is pray, walk in integrity and ask the Holy Spirit to track down the people we love.

buttons: swan as you said last night there's the fact that your H can't forgive himself for what has happened

buttons: Hi dumbfounded2 long time no "see"

Bill: buttons: I totally agree

buttons: All there was a program I heard a while back where the speaker said something interesting and I'm trying to keep it in mind as I move through things from what I can remember (or my take) there's the phrase that God doesn't put us through more than we can handle, well really it's not more than we can handle WITH HIM and the other part was that we aren't going through this because of something we've done but rather so that we can be a spokesperson for HIM

Swan: buttons - I basically ran away from home right after I graduated high school - I joined the Marine Corps. I went back to visit occasionally for some years, then at one point I realized how deeply I would become depressed after contact with my mother (she wasn't the abuser, but did allow it, I don't think she knew how to stop with honestly). I finally had to find a way to forgive my step father and mother because the depression was having adverse affects on my life and my husband and children, thanks to a wonderful counselor I was able to truly forgive them, my step father had already passed and I kind of opened communication with my mother for the last few years of her life. But more than anything when I was able to forgive them I gained a peace, so I learned I cannot hold on to things others have done to me, forgiveness is as much for myself as it is for them.

buttons: bill yes, swan was just saying that the other night and I think that so often we get ourselves into a state because we can't forgive ourselves rather than because of what others have done. God is the great forgiver and clearer of sins if He can send His son to take our sins then we have no reason to hold onto them and not forgive ourselves (another thing I heard paraphrased).

Swan: buttons - where you in my church service this past week? That is the topic the pastor spoke on and boy it was a nice reminder for me.

dumbfounded2: To all: Happy New Year! Sending you all warm regards and pray for a great new year for all.

buttons: swan no, I happen to catch the odd program on radio or TV, haven't been in church in a while as I've struggled with those who are part of the church (es) I've been in.

Swan: dumbfounded - how have you been?

buttons: dumbfounded2 Happy New Year to you too!!! Hugs and Love and continued prayers

dumbfounded2: Swan- Doing very well, but traveling a lot.

Bill: Swan: Thank you for what you shared. You pointed out two of the most important decisions that must be made in order to reach wellness and gain control over our personal growth. "I finally had to find a way to forgive" and "the depression was having adverse affects on my life." In order to overcome this kind of thing from the past, we have to set our hearts free with forgiveness. Then we have to empower our choices by taking responsibility for how life is impacting us. Way to go, keep telling this story.

Swan: buttons - I love the church I attend, it is a large church but has a bit of a small church feel and all of our pastors are awesome and I love the sermons they put together, plus the praise and worship team is soooo good. I can watch the sermons if I miss church on the website, but they don't broadcast the praise and worship, so I really miss when I have to work and can't get to church.

buttons: swan I think in the time you (and even I) were growing up women did not know there were supports out there unless they happened to meet someone who knew, most often they were afraid and, as you said, did not know what to do to stop it they did not know leaving was really an option this is not an all cases thing. I am glad you found a good counselor who helped you move forward and live a better life

Swan: buttons - this group was a life saver for me when my husband’s MLC was full blown, I thank the Lord that He helped me find this group because I honestly don't know how I would have gotten through without all of you. Support groups are valid and important.

buttons: swan one of the ladies we met doing papers attends a small church fairly close to us and I've considered going there, right now I am struggling with finding balance still and H is now not working weekends at all so that results in my brain struggling there too. I know it's not right however it's what's happening for me at the moment. I loved the church I attended when I was younger, then got upset with it when the pastor and elders told my mom she was no longer a member because she and my dad separated and yet my dad remained.

buttons: swan I too thank the Lord for this group and the support and prayers I've found here

Bill: Buttons: I am sorry to hear about the church struggles. Churches can be glorious places but they can also be agonizing places. I am convinced that churches would not exist if Jesus had not promised to sustain them (the gates of hell will not prevail against them). We live in a day and age where there are lots of options for interacting with the body of Christ. I would encourage you to keep seeking for a solution - maybe a woman's bible study or small group. Maybe a community bible study rather than a single church involvement. Maybe look for churches that have services when your H is working and see if something comes to the surface. Maybe volunteer to help a chaplain at a hospital or retirement home. Just a few ideas to put your kind heart into action.

buttons: swan when I got married we attended the church my H had been attending however the others with young children were all close (I don't tend to have "normal"/cliché) and I think they looked down on us a little because our D was born less than 9 months after we married AND we were younger and not middle-upper income. I enjoyed the praise and worship and the service however with our children I was ALWAYS called out of service when they cried and never really got to enjoy it so I stopped going the others were not called out until desperate.

Swan: buttons - sometimes we just don't find the place that we feel connected to when it comes to church, for me when I cannot go I will watch the sermons on the website, I listen to my Christian music CD's and spend time in my bible. I have been to churches that had a turn off reaction from me and I stopped attending, I am fortunate now to have a great church to attend.

buttons: bill thank you, right now it's all about my students and reaching their hurting hearts. I have some who are struggling and I'm finding my patience is not where it normally is so I keep praying for it to return and reminding myself that those are the hearts and minds I love and need to reach most

buttons: swan I always have the Christian radio station on while going to and from work and driving around there is the one program I saw on TV and need to search for and tape it since I did enjoy the part I heard, there's also a few good programs on the radio station that I can find online and listen to too.

dumbfounded2: To all: We were in Gdansk Poland last week and it was warmer there than Deep South USA.

buttons: dumbfounded2 why all the travelling? with your H?

Swan: buttons - if you want you can go on line to https://www.northcoastchurch.com/sermons/ and check out some of the sermons at my church. The fellowship of church is a valued thing; however, for me the lesson is what I am more drawn to, so when I cannot attend live, it helps to watch the sermons.

dumbfounded2: buttons- Yes, his work requires travel so I retired and go when I want

Bill: Buttons: I think teaching is one of the greatest ministries on earth. Students never forget the teachers that move their hearts and challenge their minds. If you are able to help just one student find his/her purpose and the confidence to pursue it, you have indeed made a huge contribution to life. I don't dare pray God gives you patience because that only comes through difficulty. I do, however, pray that God gives you influence in the lives of your students.

buttons: swan thank you. I will do that. I find the lessons are valuable and that's what I draw from a church service, the singing I don't mind doing on my own although not as energized as singing with others

buttons: bill I need patience so that I don't get so frustrated although I do know what you are meaning.

Bill: I echo Swan's recommendation. North coast church is a healthy place.

buttons: dumbfounded2 Wonderful!!! How fun is that!?!?!!

buttons: thank you swan and bill

Swan: buttons - the last sermon was by our younger pastor and he is so awesome, I love his energy.

Bill: I am going to sign off folks. Thank you for your investment in helping people discover hope. Please pray for Pam and me. We are in the midst of redoing our website with an expanded web presence. It is very exciting but a lot of work. I will keep you posted as we make progress.

buttons: bill I have former students with whom I still have contact, usually through their parents... one family I feel like I counseled the mom to understand her H better

buttons: Night bill Happy New Year

dumbfounded2: Buttons- Yes, lots of change but lots of growth and healing for our marriage and family.

Swan: Bill - have a wonderful evening and lots of prayers going up.

Bill: buttons. I have no doubt you are more influential in the lives of families than your realize.

Bill: Good night all.

buttons: Night ladies!!!! Happy New Year. Hugs and prayers for the year to come

dumbfounded2: Bill- goodnight

Swan: Night all, please join us again on Saturday morning.

buttons: swan thank you for sharing and for your continued support

buttons: bill yes, swan was just saying that the other night and I think that so often we get ourselves into a state because we can't forgive ourselves rather than because of what others have done. God is the great forgiver and clearer of sins if He can send His son to take our sins then we have no reason to hold onto them and not forgive ourselves (another thing I heard paraphrased).

Bill: Swan: Thank you for what you shared. You pointed out two of the most important decisions that must be made in order to reach wellness and gain control over our personal growth. "I finally had to find a way to forgive" and "the depression was having adverse affects on my life." In order to overcome this kind of thing from the past, we have to set our hearts free with forgiveness. Then we have to empower our choices by taking responsibility for how life is impacting us. Way to go, keep telling this story.

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