HopinginHim1: All - I have a quick question. As I had mentioned, H seemed to be drawing closer for awhile. And then, I saw him start to withdraw again as my S entered the residential program. I know he has anxious to attend. I think he was frightened of facing some of what might be said and issues he himself may have to address. Since then, he has remained more distant. However, he made a comment that he wanted to stop drinking at his place and only share some wine when with me (although that didn't last long!) To me that indicates that he is at least processing. However, this year away together - he is clearly more distant. And I haven't always handled things the best. I see evidence of replay here and there. I guess there really isn't a question. Just observations. Any comments you guys may have is always helpful. I am just trying to stay cool and positive but not pushy in any way.
Cricket: HopinginHim - Your son dealing with his issues and although getting help and making progress are also reminders to your H of how his actions may have contributed to your son's issues. They struggle with guilt anyway with mlc but having to face the fallout from their actions is difficult and it's common to withdraw. As your son continues to make progress, your H's guilt will lift related to your son. Your H also hates failing and struggling with alcohol is not easy for anyone but particularly H's like ours who are used to being in control.
Swan: Ladies - I heard from my daughter in law that my son is upset with his dad, there are fires near where my husband lives and he finally returned the kids calls to see how he is. He told our son that there is an evacuation order for his area, however, he isn't going to obey it, it is his house and his belongings, and no one else is going to keep it safe, so he is staying to protect his property. The other woman is long gone; she packed her valuables and bailed out immediately. Can't really say I blame her, he is acting irrationally. Son argued with him about how risky and unwise it is to stay and there really isn't anything he can really do with a water hose against a fire. Supposedly my husband then went into, everyone would be better off if the fire got him anyway, no one cares what happens to him, and he is all alone in the world. My son apparently attempted at first to say he, his wife and son, his sister and others care, but what is new that his dad is being a self-centered jerk. It really is sad that the MLCer is so willing to risk so much and not seem to care about those that love them. My daughter says she is fed up with her father's behavior and son says he is growing tired of it as well; they want to know when the man is going to finally grow up and stop acting like a spoiled two year old brat.
Hannah: Swan I am so sorry about your h but you did say last week you wondered how he would be handling it
Swan: Cricket - The disconnect they seem to develop even with friends they were so tightly bonded to is still head shaking dumbfounded to me. My husband had a friend that he had been in the Marine Corps with, truly brother in Corps. They were in Desert Storm together as well and though they have never given details to anyone, even their wives, the two got into some tight situations and saved each other’s lives while over there. I know the wife of the friend and the other woman do not get along, so there is that strain. This wife and I were not really what I would call friends; we got along, but mostly only hung out when our husband's did something that included us. There are a couple other friends that my husband lost because of the other woman, they either mentioned me or their wives did (one had a wife that insisted on bringing me up every time there were around the other woman, she said she didn't like her and was going to remind her that she didn't belong, even though I asked her not to torment the other woman). In fact my husband has lost most of his friends, those he still calls friends, he never sees and only occasionally communicates with.
Cricket: Swan - Yes, much like what has happened with my H. When we were reconnecting, one of our former officers committed suicide due to his wife having left him for an OM/former co-worker and good friend. My H and I were together when we got the news and my H immediately said we needed to drive to the Dept so he could reach out to the man who took his place as Chief. This man had been a close friend of the officer who took his life and my h knew he could be supportive. THAT is the man I always knew but he hadn't been there for anyone when he was with the OW and after and I split again, my H disconnected again. Even now when my H and my Godson became Police Chief of the Dept we both worked our whole career, my H has been disconnected. The Godson even commented to me that my H must be suffering from PTSD as he has become such a miserable, angry, negative man and he hadn't been that way before. My H's best friend (the Godson's father) has to really work at retaining a relationship with my H and this man had been the best man in my both my H's weddings to both OW. This man had been our best man too but he is the one person that it should not be hard to maintain a relationship with.
Swan: I am sadly losing interest in what is happening in my husband's life recently. I still love and care about him, but I don't know that I want to be subjected to his anger and the wrath that comes with it. I truly believe that God keeps me protected and that is mostly why there is no contact with my husband. I just don't think I could deal with that mess, I lived an abusive childhood, some abuse from my husband even thought typically not directed at me, but being in the path was bad enough. I am still open to reconciliation, but there would have to be some changes, I respect myself too much to put myself in the path of anyone's anger, even my husband's.
Hannah: Swan I feel for you. I can relate to a certain extent, I didn't have an abusive childhood, I had a very good childhood but my his still angry at me, he went through a stage where he was pleasant and talked to me about my family when I saw him at our son's house but now he can't look at me or be in the same as me. Although he did send a very nice note when my mum passed. He said if there were more people like her and my dad the world would be a better place.
Brin: Swan, amazing that the OW is feeling so insecure especially when they have been on the verge of divorcing a number of times. Nice that your H is being protective of you. But I do hope he is able to accept the job offer!
Swan: Brin - I look at it this way, she may be making the demands, but his is accepting them and following, that is on him and him alone. I agree it was nice that he even considered how it might affect me, but there are times when he has commented to others "with all he did to me" or sometime similar. The job is down closer to San Diego, I don't go down there, and have no reason to, so I don't see any problems, but the other woman does so...
Little Magpie: we are still going to couples counseling a couple times a month. But our counselor sees us churning the same things over and over again
Swan: Little Magpie - The next time your counselor says you are churning, ask them how to stop that from being the case, because those same feeling are still there and you need their guidance to away from them. If they are still an issue for both of you, they are still an issue that hasn't been resolved or apparently addressed adequately and you need a third party to guide you through them so you can finally put them to rest. Don't allow the counselor to put it all on you guys, request guidance from them to move forward. Just my thought!
Swan: Brin - we were married for 28 years, speaking to me personally was the least he could do. I know he didn't want to deal with the heartbreak it was going to cause and I also know the other woman was behind a lot of it, but he was going to show me respect. God had already instructed me not to fight, but God did not tell me to allow my husband to disrespect me in that manner.
Brin: Swan - that's cool that he invited you to dinner and talked in person.
Swan: HopinginHim - something a wonderful lady told me once was to try to find at least one positive in all situations, when I did, I often was able to focus more on that positive, even when it was only a single and small one and the circling negative wasn't able to beat me down as often.
HopinginHim1: Swan - I think that is great advice!!! I will try that too! When you force your mind to look for the positive often you remember things you had overlooked. I am very thankful my son made it into the program and he had been struggling not that long before. His struggle periods are less long and less deep than before and that is something to be thankful about as well. I am also thankful that H is clearly trying to make amends with the children. That is a big positive. And I am also thankful that he still continues to stop over most nights even if for an hour or so to chat with me. That is also a positive. What else is going on in his life is conjecture on my part. And I learned from the family program that one negative cognitive thinking pattern is "deciding" on a belief that is not known. Assuming things to be true that we cannot know.
Swan: Cricket - I don't care what some say about addiction not being transferred to generations, it is. When my son was in rehab, the counselor that lead the youth often said that parents really needed to stop blaming the children for their attraction to addictive substances and take a long hard look at their families, they will find others with the same issues. Once most did, they seemed to fall into a better understanding and were much less angry at their children. That type of anger only makes the child want to escape more and that is a lot of what drug abuse is about, escape.
Cricket: Swan - Yes, we know that addiction tendencies are genetic and during the course of adoption, this should have been discussed. The daughter who became a Marine is doing pretty well now however she had a pattern of picking the wrong guys one after another. Not only the father of her children who never stayed in the picture but after leaving the Marines, she met two different guys through her church who were both terrible. Both of them had criminal histories and probably used the church to meet trusting young women. Her family finally got her out of the recent dangerous situation and moved her to Florida (from CA) to live with her sister who recently became a police officer.
buttons: swan it breaks my heart that his step-mom said HE lost them. SHE saw them on the railing upstairs that night and by morning they were gone. He's SIX and should not have to be fully responsible for them yet he's learning
Kmkrn: buttons - yes, a 6 year old should not have that much responsibility yet.
Swan: All - As a kid, I took care of my siblings, sometimes my mother and step father, then I became a Marine and took care of myself, during my marriage I cared for two kids and did what needed to be done as a Marine wife which usually meant being the one that took care of the family so my husband could take care of being a Marine. And as my husband started diving into the MLC tunnels, my kids were grown up and I didn't have much left to take care of other than for myself. I actually am doing better at it living with my son, daughter in law and grandson, it has gotten easier to allow others to help me and not take everything on myself.
Beth: Swan I am the oldest in the family and everybody came to me when they needed help or advice. When my father was in the hospital I used to be the one talking to the Dr not my mother. It was always me who went to St John’s in my car to see him or take him for appts. The same thing happened when my mother took sick. Again when my youngest brother took sick with brain tumor. Then one sister was badly depressed and had three major surgeries on her bowels. Everybody used to step back and let me do it all.